Milk and Madness

I think the biggest pressure is our perception of what a great mom is and our expectation that we're just going to get this because it's all natural. And my biggest, advice would be just because it's natural doesn't mean it's. It's going to be easy or it's going to come naturally.

Welcome everyone. This is Nhi and Dee. We're the hosts for the Milk and Madness podcast. Thank you for joining us today. We are taking a bit of a deeper dive into expectations versus the reality of becoming a mom. And we'll be sharing some of our own personal stories with you. So much in life, you might've had certain expectations of what being a mom was going to be like.

I know. I did, and maybe it's from other friends and family members. Maybe it's from movies. Maybe it's from what you've seen in general media. We're here to give you the lowdown, the honest truth on some of our expectations.

All right. Now, this topic is something that we feel is relevant across the almost six years that we've both been mums.

But we are going to lay some foundations and start from the start, the early stages of getting basically the whole pregnancy journey, really getting pregnant, the pregnancy itself, childbirth, and even the newborn stage. Yay.

I think this is going to be fun. I've got a few questions, Dee. Sure.

What were the biggest surprises, both positive and unfortunate. Give me a quick list of stuff that comes to mind.

Okay. The biggest surprise was how difficult breastfeeding was. Yeah. That was the unfortunate surprise. The positive surprises was how actually, it was a surprise, but not really.

It was how easy my labor was, how easy getting pregnant was how easy it was up until you actually, the baby arrived, because then you actually had to do the work. So that was the positive. I come from a long line of. And I was hoping and praying that it would be just as easy for me, but I wasn't, you just don't know.

You just don't know how it's going to go until it goes, but it was very smooth sailing and a very easy process. That was a positive, but the unfortunate was definitely the breastfeeding. That was a really big eye opener for me. What about you?

Yes, I agree. Breastfeeding. Gosh, it's such, breastfeeding is such a massive thing.

Yeah. I agree. It's part of your life when you become a mom and it's something that people don't talk about. I think so many of us don't have any expectations or we might expect that because it's a natural thing that it's going to be simple. Plonk it on here, starts it, he or she knows what they're doing.

You know what you're doing. It's not the case. And I feel like I'm going to take this moment to just warn everyone listening. If you're pregnant, please just be prepared for breastfeeding to be. The other stuff that comes to mind is, the impact of becoming a mum on your life that you probably don't think about.

I know I didn't have expectations on them, or my expectations were that they weren't going to be impacted. Stuff like, your friendship group, your social life, your your identity shift. The changes that happens when you become a mom what else is there? Things that your physical, your body, your your self image of your body and what you're so used to knowing and understanding about your body, that a lot of that changes. And I expected some of that, but there were a lot of things that were a complete surprise. Like how, what is the impact of having a child on your breasts?

Or, yeah, and you just reminded me sorry, something that you just said, I was like, oh my gosh, this was a really big thing for me. The, you focus so much on your pregnancy and all the milestones, okay, at this month you're going to have a whatever shaped fruit in your body and this is what's expected and you might get some joint pain and you've got to do this appointment.

So it's. All of it is really focused around the steps of being pregnant. And then after you give birth, it everything just goes away. Like you don't hear anything else. You don't, you're not really going to so many appointments cause it's more about the baby. And so something that really shocked me was the change to my body.

Like everything that the post pregnancy. healing. And I actually ended up putting a lot of weight on after I gave birth through the breastfeeding process then when I was pregnant. So all those things were. Really strange. Like I hadn't heard anyone talk about them or anything like that.

And you don't really hear much. Like it's the, everyone's focusing on you while you're pregnant. And once you stop being pregnant and you've given birth, everyone naturally focuses on the baby and you're forgotten about a little bit. Not to say that I didn't have check ins and doctors and nurses didn't come and see me, but I don't know.

It's just, it was really, it was a really strange. experience. Now, when I think about it,

I agree. Cause I feel that there is so much buildup and so much focus on, and there's so much excitement, you get pregnant for the first time and it's just, you've entered this whole new world and it's exciting.

And I think what happens is you give birth and then really that that spotlight's taken away, that focus is taken away from you. And it's all on the baby. And I think a lot of it is so important and everything like that. But, some of the stuff that I just mentioned, all that stuff really starts to happen when you get pregnant.

You might have some friends who don't want to have kids and maybe you getting pregnant shifts that friendship. Potentially, or, you might start hanging out with some of your friends who are mothers because you are pregnant. So there are stuff that can change, your identity shift that can happen really early to you don't have to be on mat leave for it to happen.

It could be from when you get pregnant. So there are some things there. I think there's a lot of things that for me, the expectations versus reality. Is sometimes I might not even have any expectations about stuff, but then I found out that, wow, it still surprised me or it's still in a way shocked me or, I had those moments we've talked about in terms of why did anyone warn me or tell me about this?

Because I was so naive before I went through or started going through the process and the journey of becoming a mom.

Which surprises me because you come from a large family. Yes. And I, I guess coming from a large family, I'm assuming that you would have had cousins and younger, like you would have been around more kids.

Did that in any way, shape or form prepare you for

motherhood? I think in some ways, yes. More the things that you can see, though. So things that I could see. So let's say some of my aunties going through pregnancy, you can see, their body growing. You can see them. Getting tired later on you can see that stuff.

So that's stuff I expected. And that was the reality, your body grows, it changes, your body's not yours anymore, all that stuff. And then yeah, so that stuff didn't surprise me, but it's the other stuff that people don't talk about. When you go and you visit someone who's just given birth, they're not.

I don't know. In a way it's like you're showing them just the top of the iceberg, right? In terms of what they're thinking, what they're feeling. And you might visit a really close friend and they might really give you they're their honest truth in terms of how they're feeling, but and this is a bit of a generalization, obviously, but you're not getting the full understanding of what people are feeling or thinking, they're just, it's like a steer.

In front of headlights kind of situation where you've got a newborn and you visit someone and they're not telling you everything. So it's that stuff behind the scenes stuff that you, you're not exposed to, you don't see and know about it until you go through it. And then you think, Oh, okay.

I wish someone had told me this or the impact of it, or, being a mom can be really lonely. And there's just so many things that you just don't think about. And also, there are things that you might've had expectations on based on what you've seen in the media or society's expectations.

Did you feel that you had to, or did you feel pressure from society or what you've perceived expectations were to did you feel you had to meet those?

Yes, you can't not. It's social conditioning. You, you say things and you just assume that's the norm and that's what you're supposed to be doing.

And it's not until you. Live it and you break it down a little bit, you're like, why did I even think that? Or why did I even do that? But yeah. So little things that come to mind are like having to cover your baby up when you are breastfeeding or in public. Things like. Which is something that I'm still tackling at the minute cause I have a little girl piercing her ears. It's been a bit of a topic and it still is. The weight loss after being pregnant is a huge one. And like I said before, I actually put on more weight while I was breastfeeding than while I was pregnant.

And that's purely just. The change in the lifestyle not being able to exercise and then just eating, like I think I just used it as an excuse a little bit oh, I've got to eat because I need to make milk let's just eat. And just not having healthy habits and also people coming to visit, would bring things like a box of doughnuts as much as thank you so much it's really sweet.

Probably shouldn't be eating sugar when I'm breastfeeding because God knows what. The child's going to be getting out of that. But of course I had to eat the whole thing because there and I don't have time to cook. So I ended up eating it. It's really hard to peel off those layers of what you think other people expect.

And on top of that, then you put that added pressure of comparing yourself to other moms. So other moms who, whose kids sleep through the night already at one week old. And you're like, seriously, what am I doing wrong? Or moms who were able to bounce back and their bodies didn't even look like they had a child.

And those sorts of things I think are a really big struggle. When, after you've had a baby and you're going through the hormones and so much has changed, it just added as such a. A layer of complexity and anxiety. And I don't have the answer of how to not think about those things and how to not compare yourself.

I don't currently have that answer. Cause I still do. I'll be honest. I still do those things. I met someone last night who had a baby five, excuse me, five months ago. And she looked amazing. And I was like, seriously, like how? So I'm just trying to be a little bit more kinder to myself and not try and let it get to me as much as possible.

Work in progress, of course, but it's it's getting there and it's gotten a lot better from when I was A new mom. What about you? What have you found to be the biggest pressures?

I think the biggest pressure is our perception of what a great mom is and our expectation that we're just going to get this because it's all natural. And my biggest, advice would be just because it's natural doesn't mean it's. It's going to be easy or it's going to come naturally. So you know, our expectation on ourselves to just get everything really quickly.

I think the sooner you let that go, the better for your health, your mental health, your relationship with your baby, everything. So you know, breastfeeding, we're going to talk about it. On and on, but it's difficult, it's gonna be, it's gonna be painful, it most likely won't come naturally, you will need help, all good, that is okay when you are super hormonal and you just wanna cry and cry for no reason, that's fine too, that's all good, nothing is wrong, If it takes long for you to build a connection with your baby, that's okay too.

I expect it to be super simple and I was lucky, like with my kids. I felt that I remember I felt it just the second I even looked, I used to remember the moment I looked at Kenzo, my first son, I just felt this crazy if it was a movie it would have been like, like an aura, a light coming out and all this stuff.

I know from a lot of other mums that it's not instant and that's okay too. So I think the biggest thing for me is just. We've tried to let go of that pressure, it's so hard though, it's embedded in our, it's embedded in everything we do, we breathe it but and also if you do feel it and there's pressure, that's okay too.

So I think the thing is just, as you said, be easier on yourself, which is really hard. But also be easier on your friends and anyone, who's going through it because, it's tough, even if they look like they've got everything together, the chances are they probably don't

You mentioned that identity does change a lot. How did you adjust to being on maternity leave? Okay.

Yeah, your identity shifts quite a lot. And I think it's different for every woman, but for me it happens the second you get pregnant almost because your life is going to change drastically.

So yeah, your identity just changed what it did for me when I became pregnant because I knew it was just going to shift so quickly. And also, straight away. Things at work might change I was, when I got pregnant, I owned a cafe and I worked full time in corporate. I worked weekends at a cafe and I did most nights as well.

So when I went on mat leave, that stopped, right? I stopped both jobs. So straight away identity shift there and also, when you get pregnant, when you give birth and you are a mom, your friendship groups will most likely change. And that's part of your identity, who you associate with.

A lot of it wasn't intentional, but I find it's just a natural process through life. You lose people, right? Some people are in for a good time, not for a long time. That's all good. But there were people who I thought I would be friends with forever, BFFs kind of situation. And those people have dropped off since I became.

And some of them aren't mums and that might've been a factor, but not always, but I think being on mat leave and going back to work from mat leave for me was such a, it was so difficult as well. Like just changing, wearing different hats from like shifting. Your identity from this person pre pregnancy, pre baby, pre being a mom to being a mom focused on that.

This is what I'm doing every day, and then go back to work is super, really difficult. Like the identity you're like in this limbo identity situation. And for me, it was super difficult really hard. And we can talk about it and dissect it further, but it was really hard. How about you?

I have to agree. The hardest adjustment for me was the coming off maternity leave. So I, going into maternity leave, I only took two weeks and ended up having my first child early. So I ended up having all of four days on maternity leave, which was fine because that worked for me. I was already prepared.

I'd already had everything. I was ready. Like it was not a, not an issue. So I didn't really have time to adjust to the maternity leave, basically, because I only had the four days and then had the baby and then it was like, okay, now I'm a mum, I'm a mum with a living child outside of my body.

The struggle for me was putting him into childcare and going back to work. And one of the things, one of the questions that we had before was about pressure. And I just want to tie it back to that a little bit because. The pressure and the anxiety that I had around doing it all and doing what I was doing before I gave birth was a real shift to the, to my identity.

You are one person and you go to work and you do these things and you travel and you're able to go out and spend your money however you want to and then you become a parent, you become a mum and you're off work, you're not earning an income, you're not getting any superannuation, you're not getting any sick leave, you're like nothing, everything pauses for a period of time.

And if you're fortunate enough, you're financially secure, then obviously you don't have to go back to work. But if you have to go back to work, it's that decision of I'm now going back to work, have to leave my child with other people to look after. I have to pay for that as well. And you then put your work hat back on, your pre life hat, sorry pre baby life hat on.

And It's hard to split the two because you're like trying to be who you were before having kids and trying to also be a mum. So you're trying to do everything and it's really hard. That's the bit that I found the hardest about maternity leave. It's okay, I'm now spending 24 seven with this baby and that's my be all and end all.

That's my sole focus for that period of time. And now I've got to split. Those two tasks. And it's really high. And also trust somebody else with your baby as well. At the same time, that was was an experience. Thank goodness it was a positive one, but still the initial shock and stress of it all wasn't pleasant.

Yeah. And so I found that coming off mat leave was the biggest hurdle that I had to get through. I think.

I just remember, and I think I messaged you guys. When this happened, but the first day that I dropped Ken's off in childcare, I sat in the car, I just cried yeah, I remember

that.

Yeah. You messaged us. You're like, guys, I'm just thinking about it now,

but it's so hard. Yes. And, the childcare workers are so used to right? I remember them giving me hug and I'm like, don't hug me. It's just going to make it so worse. Just let me go and cry. Like it's just, it's so full on, but yeah, you're touching a good point.

And it's interesting because our approaches to starting mat leave was so different, I took two months, I think I had two months before I gave birth to Kenzo. And my husband also took some time off. We were like, we need this time. And I think I had some advice from some girlfriends, which I took.

I was like, this sounds like good advice. I'm going to do it. So I took any leave, everything that I had, and all my mat leave early. I had two months off before Kenzo came. And that was so great. I think they said to me, you won't ever get this time back. You're not gonna be able to nap ever again.

Quality time with your husband. Yes, you will get that, but it just takes time to get back there and all this stuff. And I'm like, okay. So we took two months off. We had. Dinner dates, we had movies. I went and had massages. I ate by myself. I did, I indulge in some of me stuff, which is like the creative stuff that I love with sewing and arty crafty stuff.

I just, I really immersed myself in thinking, okay, this is period, this period is going. And so we really tried to do that. And I, so I felt that when it got to Kenzo coming, I was ready because I felt like I had, I felt quite rejuvenated in a way before he came.

My personal recommendation is if you have, if you can afford it or you have the leave, take as much time as you can before your child comes, because it gets really hectic real quickly. With my second child, I took, I think we had a month, so I didn't have as much leave, but yeah, I took it a month before Ambrose.

Which was still really nice, but it's totally different the second time you have another kid to look after so it was not it wasn't that leisurely You know date night and that kind of stuff that I had with the first time around But I still tried to make sure that I had some time before stuff became really real.

Yeah, that's really good. That's great that you had that time. It was really nice. Yeah, just to almost close off that chapter and get all those things that do all those things that you know that you're not going to be able to do for a little while. That's, yeah. Really good advice.

I would have been bored out of my mind to be completely honest, but I was busy. Like we bought a car. I was going to say You sound like you did a lot in that two months.

Yeah, absolutely. There's so much to unpack, right? But on the top of your head, what advice would you give to someone or yourself if you could turn back time now and before you go on that leave, what would you, what advice would you give in terms of expectations?

Throw your expectations out the window, basically. Good or bad, whatever they might be, you just, you don't know. It's the most unique experience that you could possibly ever go through. There is no, no two people that have gone through the same experience.

There will be aspects and components of somebody else's experience that you will go through, but you will not know what's going to happen until it happens. And you will not know how you're going to deal with it until you deal with it. And because I'm the sort of person that likes to overthink things sometimes I did go and read too much and think too much about things.

And it, it wasn't like that when I had my own experience. I remember some horror stories that my girlfriends told me and it just, it, that's not how it was for me. I think take it all with a grain of salt. It's great to listen to them because if by any chance it does happen, you have a little bit of an inside scoop of what, how they dealt with it, or what might come.

But just remember that it's most likely not going to be the same. And so I think for me, if I could go back, it would be just to listen, but not really take it all on board. And I'd probably advise myself to set boundaries earlier. I think the expectation was that. A lot of people need to be around you and, when the baby comes, everyone's excited naturally as was I, but I think I really needed to set some boundaries a lot earlier and made sure that people that were coming to visit were really coming to help more so than just coming to see the baby because again, like it's, you go from being, pregnant and everyone's like, how are you feeling?

And then it's, All shifted to the baby and you're sitting there cleaning and trying to breastfeed and trying to do all these things. And in hindsight, I think I should have probably asked people to help more than just come and visit and be a visitor. They should have come to be a helper and help me. So I would give that advice to myself and say, set the boundaries early and make sure that I asked for help and not just have people to, come and visit the baby.

What about you, if you could turn back the clock a little bit, what would you tell yourself?

I would sit myself down and we'll have hot chocolates and look, there's just so much I would say because I would say, look, it's going to be tough. I would say, you're going to question a lot of stuff, get advice, but listen to your gut.

Your gut is, there's a reason why you're feeling unsure about whatever advice you've got. You've got, or, things are really difficult, get help when you need it, but also at the same time, listen to your gut. Like this is fine balance. And I think if someone had said that to me before all of it, it would have helped some of the moments where I was like, Oh my God, what do I do?

I would say rely on your partner as much as you can. And if people offer help, as you said, if they come over, accept it. Put them to work. Yeah. Yeah. So when I go to visit my friends, who have had gone through all of it so recently and they have a newborn, I'll just chat.

I'm going to just do the dishes whilst you're chatting. And they will say, no, don't worry about it. I just look at them saying, don't joke. I'm doing this. Like it's, you have no say. I'm just going to do your dishes. If you need me to tidy up that room, I'm going to do it for you. Because I know you're going through so much right now.

Any other advice? Your life's going to change. All aspects of it. So be ready for that. The majority of it is going to be for the positive, even if it doesn't feel like in the moment and when you have those really rough nights, which you are definitely going to have, just know that it will pass and that things will get better.

It's a rollercoaster though, so remember it's going to go up and down, there's always going to be new things that you're learning, so therefore you might have to question yourself or go through the whole get advice, listen to your gut cycle, but Yeah, I think that's what I would say to myself.

And knowing myself, I'd be like, whatever, sure, okay, future Nhi, sure. But that's what I would say to myself. That's what I have said to other friends as

well. That's really great advice. I think you can never really know until you, you do look back, of course. But that does wrap up today. As always, thank you for listening and for your company.

We sincerely hope that this podcast helps you in some way. We would love to hear from you. So please send us a message and tell us what's been on your mind, where you are on this crazy journey. How you're going, how you feeling about things, and just let us know if there's anything that you would like us to cover in future episodes.

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